Subject: Re: A few questions
Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 02:54:24 GMT
Message-ID: <3abf6842.40742599@newszilla.xs4all.nl>
On Mon, 19 Mar 2001 00:51:18 GMT, "Sam" <fredjonez@plopmail.com>
wrote:
> Hi, I am new to this group (referred by slashdot :) ) and after reading
> several articles I have a few questions for this group.
> How was this news group started? How long has it been around?
[although disputed: a British poster started it]
This newsgroup was created on July 17, 1991, with a forged "newgroup"
message from the MIT Artificial Intelligence Laboratory posted under
the name of "David Miscaviage" (the misspelled name of the head of the
COS). In early 1992, three additional (non-forged) newgroup messages
for the group were posted from the Lockheed Corporation, New York
University, and the University of Maine in an attempt to increase the
propagation of the newsgroup throughout the Usenet. At first, the
newsgroup was mainly a forum used by members of the "Free Zone" (a
group founded by ex-Scientologists to promote L. Ron Hubbard's ideas
independent of the COS).
http://www.skeptic.com/03.3.jl-jj-scientology.htm
http://www.xenu.net/archive/WIR/ from '95 on: the week in review
>How can the cos get away with tax exempt status after the ruling in
>California. Did they just move their operation to another state and that
>kept their status to tax exempt?
"How did a criminally active cult get IRS certification as a
tax-exempt religious order?" :
http://www.innernet.net/joecisar/con0010.htm
http://holysmoke.org/cos/wise-irs2.htm
http://holysmoke.org/cos/tax-details.htm
>Are there any ex-sc members who post here? I am not asking for specifics
>just yes or no.
yes, there are sockpuppets, clams, freezoners (just the Tech, not the
Org), a couple of ex-cos leaders, groupies, 2 ex-official-biographers
of LRH, several ex-members, and critics of all sorts :
[older:] Who's Who on ARS v2.6:
http://www.ncf.carleton.ca/~av282/who.htm
>Alot of the articles I have read are from years ago. Are there any recent
>things I can read about this cult and what kind of things they are involved
>in right now ?
http://holysmoke.org/more-theta.htm
see f.i. http://www.nettime.org/nettime.w3archive/200101/msg00132.html
http://www.nettime.org/nettime.w3archive/200101/msg00133.html
http://www.nettime.org/nettime.w3archive/200101/msg00153.html
http://www.nettime.org/nettime.w3archive/200101/msg00151.html
http://www.nettime.org/nettime.w3archive/200101/msg00163.html
http://www.nettime.org/nettime.w3archive/200101/msg00170.html
http://www.nettime.org/nettime.w3archive/200101/msg00177.html
http://www.nettime.org/nettime.w3archive/200103/msg00092.html
Also, lots of work is done now at the LMT and with their Media:
http://www.lisatrust.net/Media/index.htm ;
and then again: " 'change' appears to be a major button for scnists.
hardly surprising, since they are stuck in hubbard's world of the
1950s. guess it's kinda enturbulating that they can't control MEST as
advertised." =[ l.l.lipshitz * elkube@min.net ]=
>Are they still actively involved in business training and other businesses?
>Where can one find a list of organizations to avoid and some information on
>this subject?
According to a recent posting they even train Cisco. Their own org is
called WISE :
http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/Parliament/1455/scientology_recruitment_in_the_workplace/
a recent WiSE 99 list (US & Internat.) was posted here on a.r.s. in
february? USA: http://holysmoke.org/cos/wise99-usa.htm
>How many members are currently in cos and more specifically in the sea org?
a) 50 to 100,000.(worldwide)
b) ?
>I applaud you all for what you are doing to stop this angry cult from
>spreading.
http://search.freewinds.cx/ arscc~wdne~search
>Thanks
cep
From: Lronscam <Lronsscam@aol.com>
Subject: Re: A few questions
Date: Sun, 18 Mar 2001 22:02:14 -0500
Message-ID: <MPG.151f40bfa14ece96989709@news2.lightlink.com>
The addy of fredjonez@plopmail.com, In article ID <aKct6.591198$U46.17724570@news1.sttls1.wa.home.com>, On or about Mon, 19 Mar 2001 00:51:18 GMT, Sam says... > Hi, I am new to this group (referred by slashdot :) ) and after reading
>several articles I have a few questions for this group.
>
>How was this news group started? How long has it been around?
It was started by Scott Goehring who has posted here in the past but isn't around at the moment. He started it in 1991 or so, by a forged message. He forged David Miscavige's name by a mere mispelling. Scn'gy may not have even known about it at the time. http://www.reason.com/9604/Fe.POST.text.html Helena Kobrin, a Scn'gst and one of their full time lawyers, tried to rmgroup this NG by claiming this NG was a violation of Scn'gy's copyrights -- you know, it's got "scientology" in the title. Another reason was she tried to say the NG was forged when it got started. Here's a great URL if you care to read it. I'll warn you, however, that once you start you may never stop. :) http://www2.thecia.net/users/rnewman/scientology/usenet/rmgroup.html
Here's Helana rmgroup: Control: rmgroup alt.religion.scientology From: hkk@netcom
Subject: cmsg rmgroup alt.religion.scientology
Message-ID: <hkkD29JJB.1GA@netcom.com>
Followup-To: alt.config Sender: hkk@netcom.com (Helena Kobrin) Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest)
Date: Wed, 11 Jan 1995 22:52:23 GMT
We request that you remove the alt.religion.scientology newsgroup from your site. The reasons for requesting its removal are: (1) It was started with a forged message; (2) not discussed on alt.config; (3) it has the name "scientology" in its title which is a trademark and is misleading, as a.r.s. is mainly used for flamers to attack the Scientology religion; (4) it has been and continues to be heavily abused with copyright and trade secret violations and serves no purpose other than condoning these illegal practices. Please confirm that you have removed this newsgroup from your system. Helena K. Kobrin Counsel for trademark and copyright owner
END QUOTE This, I'll tell you, started a holy war on ARS. Too bad I wasn't around then.
Not too long after this, several months, Scn'gy decided to raid a few critic's homes: http://www.cs.cmu.edu/People/dst/Fishman/Lerma/lerma-raid.html
>
>How can the cos get away with tax exempt status after the ruling in
>California. Did they just move their operation to another state and that
>kept their status to tax exempt?
What ruling in California? >Are there any ex-sc members who post here? I am not asking for specifics
>just yes or no.
Yes. >
>Alot of the articles I have read are from years ago. Are there any recent
>things I can read about this cult and what kind of things they are involved
>in right now ?
Try http://www.lisatrust.net . A great site for up to date information is http://www.xenu.net Look for WIR or ARS week in review. It will tell you mostly what Scn'gy is up to now if you read the later ones. >
>Are they still actively involved in business training and other businesses?
>Where can one find a list of organizations to avoid and some information on
>this subject?
Yes, there business corporation is called "WISE" for World Institute of Scn'gy Enterprises. Scn'gy is supposed to get a percentage of what the company makes in exchange for them creating an Ethical environment for production. But in Scn'gy ethics is equal to production. Here is a list of WISE companies from the USA only. The full list was posted to ARS a little time ago. Do a Deja search for "WISE" in the subject and you can't miss it. It is all the countries. http://www.holysmoke.org/cos/wise99-usa.htm
>
>How many members are currently in cos and more specifically in the sea org?
Scn'gy claims 8 million, but it's a big lie. There are perhaps between 30,000 members and 150,000 members. The 30,000 might be their main people. But that might be an over exaggeration as it is. No one knows for sure how many are in the SO. Maybe 3,000 to 5,000. It's hard to say. Scn'gy lies about everything.
>
>I applaud you all for what you are doing to stop this angry cult from
>spreading.
If I were Bernie I wouldn't need applause. I would just look in the mirror and smile. :->>> SEE?
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