Ken Dandar describes how a former client was contacted by scientology PI Brian Raftery. The scientology attorneys first disputed it, then claimed that it was their right.

http://www.whyaretheydead.net/lisa_mcpherson/bob/A-022-071702-Dandar-V3.html

12 BY MR. LIROT: 13 Q Mr. Dandar, I'm going to hand you what has been 14 marked as Plaintiff's Exhibit 192 and ask you if you can 15 identify that for the Court. 16 A This was an affidavit of my client, Linda 17 Herrington, dated April 28, 1998. 18 This is a prime example of what I have been 19 talking about. She was one of the first clients I knew had 20 been contacted by a private investigator, which caused me to 21 ask Judge Moody to stop it because of what she says in this 22 affidavit, of the private investigator who I found out to be 23 Brian Raftery, who is the same investigator for the Church 24 that went after Mr. Prince a couple years later, accusing me 25 of immoral conduct with her thirteen-year-old daughter who

288 1 at the time of this interview that she relays in this 2 affidavit was 22 years old. 3 And, of course, it is all false. But accuses me 4 of crimes and accuses me of all kinds of things that they 5 are going to try to get me convicted of. It is all false. 6 But this is the client that was going to testify 7 before the Florida Bar, and two weeks before that was killed 8 in a head-on collision with a truck in Plant City where she 9 lived. And I couldn't use her testimony. 10 MR. FUGATE: Judge -- 11 A It was Mr. Raftery who alerted the Florida Bar of 12 Ms. Herrington's death. 13 MR. FUGATE: Judge, I object to that because 14 that is not accurate. This is the -- the 15 allegations that were made against me and 16 Ms. Vaughan that resulted in a Bar complaint by 17 Mr. Dandar, resulted in us having to respond, 18 resulted in a hearing, a hearing which took place, 19 and ended in a finding of no probable cause where he 20 had an opportunity to present this information and 21 any other information that he had. And it was done 22 and there was nothing that came out of it. 23 And this is another attempt, in my judgment, to 24 try to -- to besmirch the lawyers without any -- 25 sufficient evidence. And I object to it.

289 1 THE WITNESS: Could I respond to that, Judge? 2 THE COURT: No. 3 MR. LIROT: Judge, I want to ask him some 4 questions about this. 5 THE COURT: All right. 6 BY MR. LIROT: 7 Q I'll flat out ask you, was this an attempt -- 8 THE COURT: Excuse me, if that was an 9 objection, it is overruled. 10 BY MR. LIROT: 11 Q Was this an attempt to besmirch anyone? 12 A No. This is an attempt to play fair. I was 13 trying to get Mr. Fugate -- and I don't know if Mr. Weinberg 14 was involved in this but I didn't accuse him of anything -- 15 at the time it was just Mr. Fugate and his associate, Laura 16 Vaughan, before Judge Moody. 17 I brought it to Judge Moody's attention. 18 Mr. Fugate and Ms. Vaughan denied any knowledge of this 19 private investigator. In fact, they said I was making it 20 up. 21 Then I brought it to the judge's attention again 22 because other people were getting contacted. And Mr. Fugate 23 and Ms. Vaughan again denied it to the judge. 24 THE COURT: Who is Ms. Vaughan? Excuse me. 25 MR. WEINBERG: She used to be an associate at

290 1 our firm back then. 2 THE COURT: Was she working on this case? 3 MR. WEINBERG: Yes, she was. 4 THE WITNESS: So then I -- Ms. Linda Herrington 5 was meeting with this Brian Raftery four or five 6 times. Finally, she got a phone number for him. 7 I called and got his real name, because he was 8 using an assumed name with her. I subpoenaed him 9 for a hearing. And Mr. Fugate and Ms. Vaughan filed 10 a motion to quash the subpoena. And we had a 11 hearing. 12 And I recall Judge Moody looking at both of 13 them, saying, "I thought you told me on two or more 14 occasions before this hearing that Mr. Dandar was 15 making all this up and you had no knowledge about 16 this?" 17 And Mr. Fugate or Ms. Vaughan, I don't remember 18 which one, said, "No, Judge, our client had us hire 19 this private investigator, and we're allowed to 20 investigate Mr. Dandar, so it is all work product, 21 and we should not have to have a hearing on this." 22 BY MR. LIROT: 23 Q The woman approached by the private investigator, 24 what did she have to do with the Lisa McPherson wrongful 25 death case?

291 1 A She had nothing to do with it. She was a poor 2 woman, someone who I helped out for free, and her like -- 3 had like four or five kids living in a trailer park and 4 needed to vacate, they had no money. And it was my pro bono 5 service to help her out. 6 I got her -- I paid for the truck to come move her 7 trailer to Plant City on a nice half-acre lot, and she was 8 out in Gibsonton and she was happy. And, you know, I did my 9 service to the community with that case. 10 And I also represented -- I forgot -- how could I 11 forget this -- I also represented her for the death of her 12 son, unrelated. 13 But she had nothing to do with the Church of 14 Scientology, nor all my other clients that they went and 15 even coached and persuaded somehow to file Bar complaints 16 against me. 17 MR. FUGATE: Excuse me, I do object to this 18 because this was the subject of a Bar complaint and 19 hearing where he had an opportunity to bring people 20 in and to support the allegations that he makes out 21 of thin air. And it didn't happen. It didn't 22 happen. And he knows it didn't happen. And what he 23 just described to you didn't happen. And I'm sick 24 of it. 25 THE COURT: He says it did. And this is a

292 1 different hearing. And I, frankly, think he's on 2 the stand and he's been accused of some pretty -- 3 MR. FUGATE: I apologize. 4 THE COURT: -- bad things. And your objection 5 once again is overruled. 6 MR. LIROT: Judge, I would like to move Exhibit 7 192 into evidence. 8 MR. WEINBERG: Objection. This is just 9 hearsay. And the woman is dead. 10 THE COURT: Overruled. 11 BY MR. LIROT: 12 Q Mr. Dandar, I'm -- 13 THE COURT: It goes, if nothing else, to his 14 belief about people not wanting to identify 15 themselves for contributions. So it has some 16 relevance even if it is not true. I'm not saying it 17 is true or not. If she's dead, obviously we 18 can't -- you can't -- nobody can -- 19 MR. WEINBERG: I can't -- 20 THE COURT: -- get any information about that. 21 However, I'm allowing it in. 22 MR. WEINBERG: I understand that. 23 THE COURT: Just like I have allowed in a whole 24 slew of other affidavits from folks who have never 25 been here. And I have no idea if their affidavits

293 1 are true or false, like Mr. Miscavige, like just a 2 slew of people, you know, lawyers, and 3 Mr. Wollersheim, and -- 4 MR. WEINBERG: Joe Yanny and all that stuff. 5 THE COURT: Yanny. And, I mean, just a whole 6 slew of affidavits in this proceeding. 7 But as far as Mr. Dandar, some of the 8 statements he has made, what it is he thought -- 9 MR. WEINBERG: Right. 10 THE COURT: -- as far as the Church of 11 Scientology and their efforts to bother him or what 12 have you is quite relevant. So -- 13 MR. WEINBERG: I mean, just so the record -- 14 the objection is clear, it's not just an objection 15 because the allegation which is false was made 16 against Mr. Fugate or Ms. Vaughan. But it is also a 17 false allegation against our client. 18 And -- and so our objection is not just to 19 Mr. Dandar rattling off about things that have 20 already gone in front of a Bar committee, but it is 21 also rattling off about things just absolutely not 22 true about the client and talking about hearsay -- 23 THE COURT: The truth of the matter is what 24 might be relevant in a Bar complaint as far as what 25 Mr. Fugate had to do with this, if anything, is

294 1 absolutely of no never mind to me. I have no way of 2 knowing if this has to do with Mr. Fugate or not. 3 I have just ruled this has some relevance and 4 it is, therefore, admissible in this hearing. 5 MR. WEINBERG: I just wanted -- 6 THE COURT: You can talk about it all you want, 7 but it is really a very simple thing. You-all need 8 to get used to it. 9 If we ever get to trial and I rule something is 10 admissible or inadmissible, if you think you'll 11 stand up and make a huge record of it, I don't care 12 what you think about this. 13 MR. WEINBERG: No. I knew you had already 14 ruled. 15 THE COURT: Then sit down. Let's move. 16 MR. WEINBERG: Okay. 17 THE COURT: I mean, I don't expect them to get 18 up every time I let something in they think is 19 harmful to their case, they think is not true, to 20 get up and -- to stand up and say so. 21 MR. WEINBERG: I understand. 22 THE COURT: But you keep doing it.

-- Tilman Hausherr [KoX, SP5.55] Entheta * Enturbulation * Entertainment tilman@berlin.snafu.de http://www.xenu.de

Resistance is futile. You will be enturbulated. Xenu always prevails.

Find broken links on your web site: http://home.snafu.de/tilman/xenulink.html The Xenu bookstore: http://home.snafu.de/tilman/bookstore.html

<p><hr><p> From: Tilman Hausherr <tilman@berlin.snafu.de>
Subject: Ken Dandar harassed #2: another former Client contacted
Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 18:07:47 +0100
Organization: Old Europe
Message-ID: <2jhsrv4g1stnlmqrt5186vvm3a37h27c9q@4ax.com>

Another example of a former client of Ken Dandar contacted for harassment purposes: http://www.whyaretheydead.net/lisa_mcpherson/bob/A-022-071702-Dandar-V3.html

23 BY MR. LIROT: 24 Q Mr. Dandar, I'm going to hand you what we marked 25 as Plaintiff's Exhibit 193.

295 1 MR. LIROT: I have a courtesy copy for you, 2 your Honor. A copy for the clerk. 3 BY MR. LIROT: 4 Q Can you identify that document for the Court? 5 A This is -- 6 THE COURT: Now I can hear you up here. 7 MR. WEINBERG: I'm sorry. 8 A This is a more recent affidavit of a client of 9 mine, a current client of mine. And she was, back in the 10 time she wrote this affidavit, May 26, 1999, Ann Koutelas, 11 K-O-U-T-E-L-A-S. Ann Koutelas. 12 She was approached several times by a private 13 investigator and finally agreed to talk with him. He 14 actually showed her a badge, as she states in Paragraph 15 Number 3, and said they were investigating an attorney. And 16 he mentioned my name as being the one he was investigating 17 and coached her -- this is the only -- well, this is the one 18 I know for sure, coached by the investigator to file a Bar 19 complaint against me concerning a case where I represented 20 her in a fall on an elevator years ago. And she actually 21 filed a Bar complaint. 22 I only found out about it when I got a letter from 23 the Bar -- a copy of a letter to her -- saying that, you 24 know, there is nothing to talk about, the Bar wasn't going 25 to look at this at all.

296 1 But here they are alleging that I'm transporting 2 illegal weapons -- 3 MR. WEINBERG: Objection. 4 A -- and fraudulent insurance claims. 5 MR. WEINBERG: They are alleging? The 6 suggestion that -- he's reading from an affidavit 7 dated back in '99. We don't know who this woman is. 8 She apparently filed a Bar complaint against him. 9 And now it is being used against us in this 10 proceeding? 11 THE COURT: It is not being used against you, 12 Counsel. Maybe you didn't hear me. Maybe you would 13 like me to tell you again. 14 MR. WEINBERG: I'm sorry. 15 THE COURT: I think the problem, you just don't 16 listen. 17 MR. WEINBERG: I try to. 18 THE COURT: Mr. Dandar has made some statements 19 in this case. And part of his statements is why it 20 was that he believed it when Mr. Minton said that 21 some -- some anonymous folks from Europe were going 22 to donate $500,000. 23 I have kind of looked at him and said that I 24 find almost unbelievable. 25 He has said, "Yes, but the reason is that

297 1 because this is a unique case. And I knew what 2 happened and I knew it was happening to me. And I 3 knew this, that and the other thing." 4 And so now I presume this is part of what it is 5 he's trying to establish he knew why that statement 6 that seemed so farfetched to me is not farfetched as 7 to what he was thinking. I don't know what was 8 going on in his head. These are things he is saying 9 he knew, which is the only thing that makes this 10 relevant, as to why he thought some folks would give 11 half a million dollars to him and would not want to 12 be known or named or have the Church of Scientology 13 in any way, shape or form know who they were, why 14 this testimony made sense to him. 15 Now, is that the relevance? 16 THE WITNESS: Absolutely. 17 MR. LIROT: Absolutely, Judge. 18 THE COURT: So if you don't understand that, I 19 can't help you. 20 MR. WEINBERG: I understand what you just said. 21 THE COURT: I do understand that. And that is 22 why I overruled your objection. 23 MR. WEINBERG: I understand what you just said. 24 THE COURT: I'll overrule the next one if you 25 have it. So the affidavits come in because this is

298 1 part of his case to establish why that isn't so 2 farfetched as far as he's concerned. 3 MR. WEINBERG: They come in for his state of 4 mind but not for the truth? 5 THE COURT: That is exactly right. Well, they 6 come in for what Mr. Dandar believes is the truth. 7 MR. WEINBERG: That is what I said. 8 THE COURT: Obviously, he thinks they are 9 absolutely true. You people think they are 10 absolutely false. There is nothing different about 11 this than there is anything else that has gone on in 12 this case. 13 MR. WEINBERG: All right, until a minute ago I 14 had not seen them, so ... 15 THE WITNESS: This person, Ann Koutelas, I 16 continue to represent her. 17 THE COURT: But you know the truth of the 18 matter is I really don't need you to read off this. 19 I can read off it, too. If that is the relevance, 20 then, you see, I figured it out before I even read 21 it, I just read a part of it. 22 You need to introduce it. 23 MR. LIROT: I would like to introduce it. 24 THE COURT: Then what you need to do is go to 25 your closing argument to go to explain it.

299 1 MR. LIROT: Very good. 2 THE COURT: This record is way too long and, 3 frankly, I can tell that I have just about had it. 4 And I can feel it coming. You know, I can always 5 tell when I have had just about as much as I can 6 handle for the day, and then I go off and do 7 something I wish hadn't done. 8 So just introduce it and then move on to your 9 next -- 10 MR. LIROT: Judge, I move Exhibit 193 into 11 evidence. 12 THE COURT: All right. I'm going to receive 13 it. 14 MR. WEINBERG: And we have the same objection. 15 THE COURT: You have the same objection. 16 MR. WEINBERG: All right.

-- Tilman Hausherr [KoX, SP5.55] Entheta * Enturbulation * Entertainment tilman@berlin.snafu.de http://www.xenu.de

Resistance is futile. You will be enturbulated. Xenu always prevails.

Find broken links on your web site: http://home.snafu.de/tilman/xenulink.html The Xenu bookstore: http://home.snafu.de/tilman/bookstore.html

<p><hr><p> From: Tilman Hausherr <tilman@berlin.snafu.de>
Subject: Ken Dandar harassed #3: Identity theft #1
Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 18:07:53 +0100
Organization: Old Europe
Message-ID: <5jhsrvo7t3h0rqp8khdjuodl794cgoq2rg@4ax.com>

http://www.whyaretheydead.net/lisa_mcpherson/bob/A-022-071702-Dandar-V3.html

This is a first example where Ken Dandar was victim of identity theft. The likely purpose was to 1) get "stains" into his credit history 2) steal his time.

12 BY MR. LIROT: 13 Q Well, Mr. Dandar, in the context of what you just 14 testified to -- 15 THE COURT: Wait a second. 16 MR. LIROT: I'm sorry, Judge. 17 THE COURT: I heard you say earlier, when you 18 were maybe talking too fast -- but did I hear you 19 say something about your phones or your credit? Or 20 your phone or your -- either your phone or credit? 21 Did I hear you say something about either of those? 22 THE WITNESS: Actually, I said both. This is 23 what I said. Let's see. 24 When I went to buy a house, on the same street 25 where my other house was -- I moved down the

303 1 street -- I believe this was in the summer of '99, 2 applied for a mortgage. And when I went to apply 3 for a mortgage, my credit report came back. 4 I was denied a mortgage at first because I had 5 these three phone bills. That is where they come 6 together. Three phone bills appear on my credit 7 report. And -- one in Minneapolis, one in Dallas, 8 Texas and one in Southern California. And they had 9 my Social Security number on all of those. But they 10 had some of my other family history incorrect. But 11 they still were under my name, under my Social 12 Security number, on my credit report, which caused 13 my mortgage company to say no until I got rid of 14 those charges. 15 THE COURT: These were three bills -- three 16 phone bills in three different cities or states that 17 were not yours, I gather? 18 THE WITNESS: Right. I never lived there. 19 THE COURT: Still unpaid at the time you made 20 your application? 21 THE WITNESS: Correct. That is the first time 22 I discovered, when I made my application for a 23 mortgage. 24 THE COURT: Where were they? What cities and 25 states?

304 1 THE WITNESS: Dallas, Texas phone company where 2 Lisa McPherson used to work. 3 THE COURT: Dallas, Texas -- 4 THE WITNESS: Phone company. 5 THE COURT: What is it, is this a number? Just 6 a number out there? 7 THE WITNESS: I'm sorry, it is like -- I think 8 it is called -- I can't remember the name, Southern 9 Bell located in Dallas, Texas. Someone went to an 10 apartment, opened up -- you know, rented an 11 apartment, I guess in my name, I don't know about 12 that, but they opened up a phone service, private 13 phone service, residential, in my name in Dallas, 14 Texas. 15 THE COURT: Made long distance calls? 16 THE WITNESS: Ran up a bill. 17 THE COURT: Didn't pay it? 18 THE WITNESS: Didn't pay it. Somebody went to 19 Minneapolis where Dr. Coe is and Dr. Bandt, opened 20 up a residential phone service in my name, ran up 21 the bill and then didn't pay it. 22 Somebody went to Southern California, opened 23 the account, same thing, ran up a phone bill, didn't 24 pay it. 25 So they all show up on my credit report.

305 1 THE COURT: All in your name with your Social 2 Security number attached to it? 3 THE WITNESS: Absolutely. 4 THE COURT: Did you ever live in any of those 5 three places? 6 THE WITNESS: No. 7 THE COURT: Did you ever have phone service in 8 your name in any of those three places? 9 THE WITNESS: Never. 10 THE COURT: Okay. 11 THE WITNESS: So what I did, I had to go to the 12 City of St. Petersburg, because I lived here for a 13 long time, you know, and I have been a resident of 14 Tampa Bay for 24 years, between St. Pete and Tampa. 15 And I had to go get my utility bills for these 16 months and I had to send them in. 17 Everyone dismissed those bills off my credit 18 report except the phone company where Lisa McPherson 19 used to work where I know that her boss was a 20 Scientologist, because that is what her mother told 21 me. So that bill remained unpaid. 22 I sent them all of the stuff. They refused to 23 take it off my credit report. I could have sued. 24 But my bank said, "Look, we'll pay the bill 25 ourselves. We want your business." So they paid

306 1 the bill. 2 BY MR. LIROT: 3 Q In the context of -- 4 THE COURT: Got your credit cleared up 5 eventually? 6 THE WITNESS: Right, because the bank lending 7 me the money for the house said, you know, "We'll 8 pay the darned thing off," because I was going to 9 sue. And I don't have time to do that.

-- Tilman Hausherr [KoX, SP5.55] Entheta * Enturbulation * Entertainment tilman@berlin.snafu.de http://www.xenu.de

Resistance is futile. You will be enturbulated. Xenu always prevails.

Find broken links on your web site: http://home.snafu.de/tilman/xenulink.html The Xenu bookstore: http://home.snafu.de/tilman/bookstore.html

<p><hr><p> From: Tilman Hausherr <tilman@berlin.snafu.de>
Subject: Ken Dandar harassed #4: Identity theft #2
Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 18:07:55 +0100
Organization: Old Europe
Message-ID: <ajhsrvkbpg900gd7oif67p49taire4bgqp@4ax.com>

http://www.whyaretheydead.net/lisa_mcpherson/bob/A-022-071702-Dandar-V3.html

A second example where Ken Dandar was victim of identity theft:

(page 311)

13 I have had credit card entries. Somebody 14 purchased $8,500 of stereo equipment on my credit 15 card. My credit card company caught it. Someone 16 purchased a $2,800 diamond ring from Spiegel catalog 17 in December 2000. Not mine. My credit card company 18 caught that.

-- Tilman Hausherr [KoX, SP5.55] Entheta * Enturbulation * Entertainment tilman@berlin.snafu.de http://www.xenu.de

Resistance is futile. You will be enturbulated. Xenu always prevails.

Find broken links on your web site: http://home.snafu.de/tilman/xenulink.html The Xenu bookstore: http://home.snafu.de/tilman/bookstore.html

<p><hr><p> From: Tilman Hausherr <tilman@berlin.snafu.de>
Subject: Ken Dandar harassed #5: invasion of privacy
Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 18:07:58 +0100
Organization: Old Europe
Message-ID: <cjhsrv862cf5ivhip9dip0oe9b9i816k9a@4ax.com>

This is what also happened to Richard Behar - companies with whom he never did any business accessed his credit report:

http://www.whyaretheydead.net/lisa_mcpherson/bob/A-022-071702-Dandar-V3.html

20 THE COURT: I'm talking about things that 21 specifically you think happened to you that you 22 would -- but you are saying you knew about some 23 other things that also influenced you to think 24 that -- 25 THE WITNESS: All these things -- these are

308 1 things that -- 2 THE COURT: That influenced you? 3 THE WITNESS: Yes, since '97. The other thing 4 is the credit card -- or the credit report was one 5 thing. But on my credit report there were also 6 inquiries made by different companies. And I didn't 7 do -- that is the first time I heard Hana Whitfield 8 talk about that. I didn't do what she did. I 9 didn't call up and try to investigate this. I just 10 saw there were a bunch of inquiries made on my 11 credit report, which also caused me some financing 12 difficulties, I'll say, in -- down the road because 13 no one -- I could not explain why these inquiries 14 were being made on my credit report when I didn't 15 apply for credit with any of those companies. They 16 just -- it just shows up on your credit report and 17 that causes your credit rating -- which mine was 18 very high -- to start to go down and cause people 19 who want to lend you money or finance things to ask 20 you a lot of questions.

-- Tilman Hausherr [KoX, SP5.55] Entheta * Enturbulation * Entertainment tilman@berlin.snafu.de http://www.xenu.de

Resistance is futile. You will be enturbulated. Xenu always prevails.

Find broken links on your web site: http://home.snafu.de/tilman/xenulink.html The Xenu bookstore: http://home.snafu.de/tilman/bookstore.html

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