>Rod Keller <rkeller@unix01.voicenet.com> wrote in
>news:FJOH9.1010$9c.111190@news2.voicenet.com:
>>
>> Yeah, I do appreciate that. The days of a.r.s being a place to
>> exchange opinions have long since passed.

Rod, your statement caused me to recall something from around 24 years ago during my Sea Org days at ASHO.

Back in about 1978 I became aware that Scientology International management, as well as staff working in Flag's Office of Eval and Execution, had circulated misinformation about me in an Aides Order (in the form of an "eval"). I found out about the black propaganda being circulated about me by reading a brief mention of it in a second "Flag Eval" called "The End of Cautiousness Eval". This 2nd "eval" was sent to ASHO by telex. I have a copy of the issue. It contains, amongst other things, *proof* in Scientology's *own* words that certain Scientology executive management staff were doing some pretty nasty things. I'm talking about the commission of *criminal* acts -- violations of US laws. The person I am talking about was an executive employed by the Church of Scientology of California. This executive staff member committed forgery and mail fraud, according to documented information contained in Scientology's legal, finance and invest bureau ("B1") files.

Now in the later (2nd) "eval", there was a section which stated that the criminal executive had me working for him, participating in the fraud as his "pawn". The 2nd issue also said, "The effects on [the] Dir[ector of] Disb[ursements] [me at that time] as have been found in an earlier eval..."

Naturally, I wanted to know what had been published and circulated about me, in order to clear my name. I felt at that time that I had been "3rd partied". This is Scienospeak for "spreading destructive rumors behind another's back with the intention of causing upset between people". I wanted to be able to confront my accusers, as it were, but I was told by management that I could *not* see the issue containing the lies that had been circulated about me. Nor was I even allowed to know the *name* of the person (the source or origin of) the vicious rumor which was broadly circulated to executives at various levels of Scientology management.

Deana's actions towards Gerry Armstrong remind me of how I was treated by Scientology. It's the same sort of thing. Only the terminology used to describe it is different, in some ways.

The reason Deana's actions (the spreading of a rumor from an unknown source) remind me of how I was treated, is that both instances (mine in 1978, and Gerry's lately) involve persons who are the target of black propaganda being spread by *known* entities (Scientology in my case, and Deana in Gerry's case). And in both cases, when we have tried to learn the source of the rumors and black propaganda, we have been denied, even though we both, at our different points in time, tried to handle the matter discretely, and on "proper" or "socially accepted" channels.

Instead of being allowed to confront my accuser (who remained an unknown, un-named Scientologist to me), I was subjected to more insane black PR from those who knew the source of the black PR.

Gerry is a targetted recipient of the same sort of insane attacks, except the attacks come not only from OSA but also from attackers who act like OSA Scientologists doing black ops. Persons who attack, and in doing so, further Scientology's insane black PR and fair game policies are acting much like OSA black PR operatives.

The best way to stop the vampires engaged in their bloodthirsty feeding frenzy is to shine the light of truth on them in the form of a mirror.

Warrior - Sunshine disinfects http://warrior.xenu.ca

> In article <Xns92DBB7E4D6B21mirelesonicnet@208.201.224.154>,
> Deana Holmes (mirele@sonic.net) wrote:
>
>Not that you've helped things, Rod Keller, because you still have
>your nose firmly shoved up Bob's ass.
>
>Deana M. Holmes

Sadly, you seem unable to communicate without engaging in name-calling and insulting people.

In article <Xns92DCC182D1B4Dmirelesonicnet@208.201.224.154>, Deana Holmes wrote:

>
>Warrior, you can go to hell. I'm certainly not going to let Rodless Keller
>slip by with another one of his petty remarks. I've had it with jackasses
>like you and Rodless. I don't care if you hate me, but you're not going to
>just be able to trash me and get away with it.

You trashed this newsgroup with more of your own profanity, Deana.

Look in the mirror.

I don't hate you, Deana. Apparently you are so ashamed of your potty mouth, and your continued nasty little black PR, that you engage in yet another ad hominem attack rather than speak in a civil manner or respond to our very civil questions, courteously and discretely asked. In fact, I think these days the only way you apparently remain civil to some of us is when you keep your mouth shut and your fingers off your keyboard.

Are you capable of communicating in a civil and rational manner?

Warrior - Sunshine disinfects http://warrior.xenu.ca

>Go to hell! I'm sure you'll meet your friends there in droves.
>
>Deana M. Holmes
>mirele@sonic.net

Subject: Re: Light and Mirrors - Re: New Scientology memo at lisamcpherson.com
From: "kady@wwwaif.net" <kady@wwwaif.net>
Message-ID: <Xns92DD68A511527kadywwwaifnet@207.35.177.135>
Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 15:17:15 GMT
Organization: Bell Sympatico

Warrior <warrior@xenu.ca> wrote in news:asss8g018po@drn.newsguy.com:

>>Rod Keller <rkeller@unix01.voicenet.com> wrote in
>>news:FJOH9.1010$9c.111190@news2.voicenet.com:
>>>
>>> Yeah, I do appreciate that. The days of a.r.s being a place to
>>> exchange opinions have long since passed.
>
> Rod, your statement caused me to recall something from around 24
> years ago during my Sea Org days at ASHO.
>

<snip - sorry, just wanted to get to the gist>

Warrior, I think I've figured out your point - please correct me if I'm wrong. You are upset because Mirele said this:

"I have been told that you are delusional and that I should excuse your lying on that basis."

Now, for some reason, you are focusing on the first part of the sentence, and not the whole, and assuming that the reason Mirele believes Gerry is delusional is because someone told her so. However, you are misinterpreting the context, and I know, because I was there when this subject first came up. The question of whether or not Gerry was delusional was not in dispute;

the point being made to Mirele by the person in question was that she - Mirele - should stop going after Gerry Armstrong's lies *because* he is delusional.

One can form an opinion on whether or not Gerry is delusional by simply reading his posts to a.r.s.; I would suggest in particular his most recent response to the current lawsuit against him, which he has webbed here:

http://www.gerryarmstrong.org/50grand/legal/a7/armstrong-answer- cv021632.html

If you read the entire document - not skim it, read it, and think about the claims - it should be readily apparent why some people hold the opinion that he is delusional. If you are not yet convinced that there is ample reason for someone to come to the conclusion that he is delusional, the very existence of his "GOonSquAdfollies" page, the reasoning behind it and the criteria used to add names to his list should suffice.

That page is here:

http://www.gerryarmstrong.org/50grand/cult/usenet/goon-squad-follies.html

I do not expect you to share the opinion that Gerry is delusional, as it really comes down to personal opinion. However, I fear you are labouring under a misassumption when you suggest that the only reason that Mirele believes that he is delusional is because she was told that he was delusional; what she was, in fact, told was that she should stop confronting him about what she saw as "lies", since his delusional outlook made him believe that he was telling the truth, and as such, no malice was intended. She did not agree.

Hope this clears that up.

K

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