Path: rambo.bobo.net!xs4all!xs4all!newsfeed.wirehub.nl!newsxfer.visi.net!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.gtei.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!207.155.183.80.MISMATCH!global-news-master From: inFormer@informer.org (Rev Dennis Erlich) Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology Subject: Re: "Shattered" minds Date: 24 Nov 1998 15:51:41 PST Organization: inFormer Ministry [a 501(c)3 non-profit, religious organization] "... in service of cult victims and their families." Lines: 90 Message-ID: <366e454f.31300931@news.concentric.net> References: <36434818.32145259@news.tiac.net> <7348qn$356@enews3.newsguy.com> <73c9u9$i8o$1@nntp1.u.washington.edu> <73ckr0$ale@enews4.newsguy.com> <3667e4a6.235540248@localhost> <366c34c7.15117887@news.concentric.net> <73e6b5$emt@enews4.newsguy.com> <3663da88.3961205@news.concentric.net> <73f8a5$4fs@enews3.newsguy.com> Reply-To: informer@informer.org NNTP-Posting-Host: ts029d04.lax-ca.concentric.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 X-No-Archive: yes Xref: rambo.bobo.net alt.religion.scientology:147385 "Rebecca Hartong" : >>>First, I have never downplayed the damage that some people suffer during >>>cult membership, I have only questioned the ultimate *source* of that >>>damage. yhn >> As in, they did it to themselves? rebecca >As in, their psychological vulnerability allowed them to be hurt in ways >that others would not have been hurt. ... and therefore it is they who are ultimately responsible for their having been mindfucked? >> The cult or themselves; what >>other factors could you possibly mean? > >This brings me back to something I wrote in earlier post. I believe a >person can be the ultimate source of their own bad condition without being >responsible in a punitive sense. In other words they can be adjudicated to have been victimized by a predatory culprit whose nefarious activities need to be curtailed or dis-encouraged by authorities? >(Ack... I'm sounding almost >Scientological there, aren't I? Not hardly. But your thinking so shows your depth of understanding of the scienokultic mindset. >Still, that is one thing the Scientologists >and I seem to agree on: Ultimately, each of us is responsible for >everything we think and feel.) That's not exactly a new revelation, is it? Nor is it even entirely true. But I should someone else tear up the idea that "... each of us is responsible for everything we think and feel." Everything we think and feel is our responsibility? Wow! I feel so "empowered." >>>And as for dismissing people >>>for whining, Dennis, that remark applied only to you. >> >> You've mentioned it several times. I consider you a friend enuf to >>hear your criticisms fully and to consider them. But you won't >>explain these whiny remarks, so I have to assume you are just trying >>to hurt my feeling. > >It was inappropriate for me to have written that the couple times I did. >I'm sorry, and I hope you will accept my apology. Of course I do, Rebecca. No big. But be careful of hurting my feeling in the future. It's the only one I've got left. >I became frustrated >because it seemed that you were reading all sorts of things into my words >that just weren't there. Just trying for clarification from your admittedly more objective perspective. >(I'm referring to your suggestion that I must >believe the planet would be better off if everyone who was vulnerable to >cult manipulation were simply off-loaded somewhere. I don't believe that >and I resent the implication that I do believe it.) I dint think it was true, but I wanted to point out that one possibly could misinterpret your word to mean that. Now it is my turn to apologize to you for implying that you could possibly think that. >> Characterizing my remarks as whining is per se dismissive. > >You're right. I should have taken the time to explain why I was offended by >your characterization of *my* remarks. >Again, I apologize. Done deal, Rebecca. Smoochies! Rev Dennis Erlich * * the inFormer * *