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From: Bob Minton <bob@minton.org>
Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 11:31:33 -0400
Organization: The Lisa McPherson Trust, 33 N. Fort Harrison Ave., Clearwater, Florida 33755 Telephone (727) 467-9335, Fax (727) 467-9345
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Date: Tue, 9 May 2000 23:45:52 EDT
Confessions of Mohammed Abacha:
How We Stole $700 million "My father gave me $700 million for safe keeping in my house"
Part 2 Q: Why did the amount of money cause you to raise it with your father?
A: I didn’t have --- then I thought it was more reasonable to send these monies abroad. It was not proper to just keep cash like that.
Q: What did you ask him?
A: I did explain to him the scenario and that was basically it, and I suggest that I should send the monies abroad. He didn’t oppose that.
Q: What was your suggestion as to where it should go?
A: I beg your pardon?
Q: What was your suggestion that you made to him as to where it should go?
A: It was just a general suggestion. I didn’t suggest a particular place.
Q: You just said: "I suggest this goes abroad"?
A: That’s right.
Q: What was his response to that?
A: It was all right.
Q: He said "Fine"?
A: It was okay, yes.
Q: Did he not want to know where it was going?
A: It was already in my custody so --- Q: Did you tell him where it had gone once you had moved it abroad?
A: No.
Q: Did he ask?
A: No.
Q: So you had no further discussion about it at all?
A: No.
Q: Did he ever ask for any of the money back?
A: No.
Q: Did you have any records as to where the money had gone?
A: I think I did.
Q: Did you keep an account for him as to where the money was?
A: I kept an account for myself.
Q: For yourself?
A: Yes.
Q: Not for your father?
A: I kept it as usual. Whenever you send, or whenever you have something you send, you keep an account of it. Mr. Bagudu also kept an account of it.
Q: What sort of account did you keep? Was this a running list as to what money you had been given and where it was?
A: Yes, something of that nature.
Q: Kept in what form?
A: A piece of paper.
Q: I cannot hear you, Mr. Abacha?
A: A piece of paper.
Q: A piece of paper?
A: Yes, a document.
Q: Was this manuscript or typed?
A: Written.
Q: Written --- handwritten?
A: Handwritten, yes.
Q: Which you add to, would you, on each occasion that some money went through your hands?
A: That is correct.
Q: Would you add to it when you received money, or only when you passed on?
A: Both.
Q: Both, so you kept a running ledger?
A: Correct.
Q: Of money that you had received and money you had passed on?
A: That is correct.
Q: Do you still have that ledger?
A: I should think so.
Q: Did your father discuss this with Mr. Bagudu?
A: No.
Q: Whose money did you regard this as being?
A: As I said earlier, I think it was handed over to me and that’s all.
Q: You regarded it as your father’s money?
A: Well, I can’t tell you exactly. It was handed over to me. He handed it over to me. I would, of course, regard that.
Q: I am sorry, did you say --- I am sorry, it is the fan.
A: I would regard --- I would think so.
Q: You would think so?
A: Yes.
Q: You think that it is your father’s money?
A: He handed it over to me.
Q: You believed it to be your father’s money?
A: He handed it over to me.
Q: You understood it at the time to be your father’s money?
A: As I said, he handed it over to me.
Q: You understood it at the time to be your father’s money?
A: I didn’t ask him but he handed it over to me.
Q: That was your understanding --- A: That was right.
Q: --- of him handing it to you?
A: That is correct.
Q: You certainly did not regard it as Nigeria’s money?
A: I didn’t know where it came from.
Q: Did you ever ask him at any stage where it had come from?
A: No.
Q: Where did you think it had come from?
A: I didn’t know at that time.
Q: Did you know what his salary as Head of State was?
A: No.
Q: It was approximately $2,000 a year. Did you know it was of that order?
A: I have never known about his salary.
Q: Did you think that this was his salary?
A: I didn’t think any of that.
Q: Did you apply your mind to this at all?
A: No.
Q: Why not?
A: As I said earlier, I didn’t ask any question.
Q: You understand it to be your father’s money?
A: He handed it over to me.
Q: You know no basis upon which he could have money?
A: I beg your pardon?
Q: You knew of no basis upon which he could have that money?
A: Come again, please?
Q: You know of no basis upon which he could have that money that he was handing over to you?
A: I didn’t know.
Q: You did not ask?
A: I didn’t ask.
Q: You knew of no legitimate basis upon which it could be money that he is handing to you as his own?
A: I said I didn’t ask.
Q: At the time, Mr. Abacha, I would suggest that you knew that this was simply stolen money.
A: I didn’t know about that.
Q: If you had applied your mind to it for one moment that would have been the conclusion that you reached?
A: I never did.
Q: You never applied your mind to it --- is that what you say?
A: I didn’t conclude it.
Q: Did you not think at all as to "What on earth could my father be doing giving me $700 million in cash"?
A: I beg your pardon?
Q: Did you not think at all as to what on earth your father could be doing giving you $700 million in cash?
A: It didn’t cross my mind.
Q: Did you ever discuss this with Mr. Bagudu?
A: Discuss what?
Q: What your father was doing handing you $700 million in cash?
A: I can’t remember, I don’t recollect.
Q: Did he ever ask you for an explanation as to what it was?
A: I can’t remember.
Q: Did you ever speculate with him as to what it is?
A: I can’t remember.
Q: You have no recollection of any discussion with Mr. Bagudu?
A: I can’t remember.
Q: And no recollection of any discussion with your father?
A: These are events that happened over a very long period of time. I don’t have any specific recollection as to issues like that.
Q: Certainly no suggestion, was there, made by you --- A: I beg your pardon?
Q: Certainly no suggestion made by you to Mr. Bagudu that this was somehow part of a legitimate government operation?
A: Mr. Bagudu had access to people more in the financial sector or in the government. He had a better understanding of a lot of these things, but I can’t remember discussing issues of that nature with him.
Q: You could not make that suggestion --- A: I beg your pardon?
Q: You could not make that suggestion to Mr. Bagudu because you had no knowledge of it?
A: As to?
Q: As to there being any legitimate reason?
A: As I said, I didn’t ask.
Q: Sorry, I missed the answer.
A: I said I didn’t ask.
Q: You did not ask?
A: I didn’t, yes.
Continued in (3)
