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From: Bob Minton <bob@minton.org>
Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 11:31:07 -0400
Organization: The Lisa McPherson Trust, 33 N. Fort Harrison Ave., Clearwater, Florida 33755 Telephone (727) 467-9335, Fax (727) 467-9345
Message-ID: <640jhso3n4bq6cevdfv5in114jtgtbo5pk@4ax.com>
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Date: Tue, 9 May 2000 23:31:56 EDT
Confessions of Mohammed Abacha:
How We Stole $700 million "My father gave me $700 million for safe keeping in my house"
Part 3 Q: Did you discuss it with Mr. Bagudu?
A: I can’t remember discussing it.
Q: You cannot recall Mr. Bagudu ever asking you?
A: I can’t recall that.
Q: When was Mr. Bagudu first used as a conduit for these funds going out of the country?
A: I can’t remember exactly. I know that he did all the movements, not me.
Q: He did the movements, but when?
A: I don’t have a specific recollection.
Q: Approximately when, at the start when you start transferring money out abroad, or after you have been doing it for a year or two years?
A: My idea about that would have been ’96 when I started that aspect with him.
Q: When about in 1996?
A: I can’t remember exactly.
Q: And how was this dealt with between you and Mr. Bagudu?
A: I did hand over the cash to him.
Q: What did you say when you were handing it over?
A: We had this arrangement for it to be sent through the bank.
Q: You had what arrangement?
A: That he would send it to the Central Bank.
Q: When did you make this arrangement?
A: When I did first discuss with him the possibilities of moving these funds.
Q: When was this?
A: I can’t remember exactly.
Q: What arrangement was made between you and Mr. Bagudu?
A: He made the arrangements. I handed the cash over to him and he facilitated the move.
Q: Yes, But what is the arrangement between you and Mr. Bagudu?
A: In what sense?
Q: Where is the money to be transferred? Did you discuss that? Was there an arrangement, as it were?
A: Yes, to most of the accounts that they were found.
Q: I am terribly sorry, I could not hear that?
A: To most of accounts that were identified in the documentation.
Q: Was this discussed before transfers were made?
A: Sometimes and sometimes not.
Q: Which accounts were discussed?
A: I beg your pardon?
Q: Which accounts were discussed as to where the money should go?
A: Most of the accounts that were held jointly with Mr. Bagudu.
Q: So you had a discussion with Mr. Bagudu that the large sums of cash you are giving him should be transferred abroad to the accounts that you hold jointly with Mr. Bagudu?
A: That is correct.
Q: Why is it decided to go there?
A: It was a decision between me and him.
Q: So you discussed it?
A: A little, yes.
Q: What was that discussion?
A: Mostly short discussions actually.
Q: Was it a debate as to where those funds would be best placed?
A: There was never a debate.
Q: Whose suggestion was it that it should go into those accounts?
A: Sometimes mine, sometimes his.
Q: No, but at the start when you were making the arrangement that you have been referring to?
A: Yes.
Q: Whose suggestion was it to your accounts?
A: It has been quite some time. I can’t remember exactly. As I said, I did suggest sometimes, he did suggest sometimes.
Q: Sometimes he suggested it --- A: Yes.
Q: --- you are saying A: Yes.
Q: But did you suggest it initially?
A: I did sometimes. I cannot tell you if it was initially or later on exactly.
Q: Why were you suggesting your accounts?
A: I beg your pardon?
Q: Why were your suggesting your accounts?
A: Because, as I said, the monies were already in my possession and they were just meant for safe keeping.
Q: Did you tell him the terms on which the money was being put into the accounts?
A: No, we later discussed that aspect for the monies to be invested. There is no need to put money --- some money or amounts in an account without them being invested.
Q: Did you tell him the monies were there in safe keeping for your father?
A: No.
Q: Did he ask you what they were for?
A: No, I said so.
Q: He made no enquiry of you at all?
A: No.
Q: When did you discuss investing the funds?
A: I think some time after a sizeable amount had been transferred.
Q: By a sizeable amount, how much do you mean?
A: I can’t remember exactly, a sizeable amount.
Q: What discussion was there as to investment?
A: He brought out most of the ideas about the investment.
Q: Was it his proposal to invest it?
A: I would believe so, yes.
Q: Did you discuss investment with your father?
A: No.
Q: What was the proposal for investment by Mr. Bagudu?
A: He felt there is no need to keep any monies in accounts like that for them without accruing any interest or being invested in anything.
Q: Were they not even in deposit accounts?
A: I beg your pardon?
Q: Were they not even in deposit accounts to begin with?
A: They were in deposit accounts.
Q: They were?
A: I believe so, yes.
Q: So they were accruing interest?
A: Compared to being invested.
Q: Was he advising you that they should be invested in securities?
A: He did most of the advising.
Q: Sorry, he did most of the?
A: Advising.
Q: He was positively advising you as to how these should be invested?
A: That is correct, yes.
Q: And the suggestions as to how they should be invested came from him?
A: That is correct.
Q: Did you discuss par bonds with him?
A: We did, yes.
Q: What was your discussion about par bonds?
A: We discussed --- I believe he brought up the advantages of par bonds and something of that nature.
Q: Were you persuaded that investing in par bonds was a good idea?
A: It was a good idea, yes.
Q: Did you discuss that with your father?
A: No.
Q: Did you give Mr. Bagudu a discretion as to how to invest these funds, could he only invest them with your prior permission?
A: We discussed it most of the time.
Q: Did you give him a discretion?
A: Discretion?
Q: Yes.
A: I cannot exactly say if I did, but most of the time whenever there was an issue or like that we discussed it, but he most of the time did it.
Q: I hope you have a bundle near you called bundle 10.
A: Yes.
Q: Can I show you two documents in this bundle? Could you go to tab 32?
A: Yes.
Q: Do you have a paginated bundle? You appear not to.
A: No.
