Date: Thu 18 Aug 88 21:43:54
From: David Rice (on 161/93)
To:   All
Subj: When Will I Die? Astrology Article

     "Please,  come  in,"  you  say with warmth and a smile,
standing up to greet your client.  This morning you find  it
particularly difficult to smile, what with the rent past due
and the bills piling up. but you manage.  Your prefabricated
smile  turns  genuine  when  your client looks up and smiles
gamely back.  You take her by the elbow and guide her to the
plush vinyl chair.  Taking a seat yourself, you  say  "Thank
you very  much  for coming today.  I've been working on your
chart, and I feel we have much to share this morning."   You
offer her coffee or tea.  She declines.

     You  get  two  sentences  into your carefully rehearsed
allocution before she interrupts.

     "Excuse me, there was something else I wanted  to  talk
about."   You  pause while she looks at her right shoe. "Ah,
I'd like to, ahum," she begins, switching her  gaze  to  the
left  foot,  about where her second toe from the right would
be, as if she could see through the leather.    She  crosses
her arms. "I want to know when I'm going to die."

     You  have  been  asked this question many times before,
and know what to say.  You wait a  moment  to  collect  your
thoughts, and give her your answer.

     What will your answer be?

     "To  Tell  Or  Not  To  Tell?" has long been a favorite
subject for Astrologers who love to argue.  Often  one  will
find  an astrologer who loves to switch sides just to be The
Pain in the Ass at the annual astrology convention.    Other
astrologers,  who have learned to shut up and sit quietly at
parties, will just smile inertly at  you  if  you  ask  this
question, with  a  superior  grin  on their ugly mugs.  This
last mutation is usually the most annoying.

     Still, the debate is a valid one.  One astrologer  will
tell  you  that  to tell a person when she or he will die is
often the catalyst to making it happen.   Another  will  say
that  the  astrologer  has  the responsibility to answer the
client's questions truthfully and  honestly.    And  another
will  argue  that  it  isn't possible to note one's death in
one's chart.  And yet a fourth will choose  any  combination
of these scenarios, based in direct proportion to the amount
of alcohol consumed at the Johndro Award Dinner an hour ago.

     Perhaps  the worse advice I've ever heard an astrologer
tell his client when asked the question "When will  I  die?"
was:  "When  you wish to," then going on to offer unearthly,
immaterial, bodiless, incorporeal, insubstantial, spiritual,
preternatural, "New Age" metaphysical pabulum.   How  inane!
How  utterly,  abysmally worthless advice when one is living
here in the Real World!   Many  astrologers  feel  a  person
chooses  when  to  be  born, die, and every event in between
before the person incarnates.  But your  client  didn't  ask
"What's your opinion on why a person dies?"  Your client has
asked  a  very personal question, the answer which you offer
may be vitally important to her or him.

     Another way of answering this question  is  the  "Judo"
approach.   That  is,  taking  the  energy  embodied  in the
question and deflecting it away from you, thus  freeing  you
from answering.    The  format  of  the answer could be: "We
can't see death in a chart.  That's strictly Hollywood-movie
astrology," and continuing with the session.  Or perhaps "My
teacher doesn't believe it's possible, so we  never  discuss
it."

     There  are  many  schools  of astrology that teach that
one's death is very  much  possible  to  discover  in  one's
chart.   Indian  astrologers using the Novian chart look for
death of the native out of hand: If they didn't, the  client
would  look  elsewhere  for  an astrologer (their most asked
question is "When will my children  be  born,"  followed  by
"When will I die."  See Warren Murphy's "Indian Astrology").

     And  then  there is the view that one's chart will only
show the deaths of  those  around  one  (parents,  siblings,
friends).   Using  this train of thought, the astrologer can
answer the question "When will  I  die?"  by  examining  the
charts of those around the client.  I feel this is valid, as
I've  seen  charts  of  widows  who  had  "dying" issues and
adjustment concerns in their charts at  the  time  of  their
husbands  deaths,  but  their  husbands charts often showing
little more than periods of leisure and learning!  [Since  I
feel  that  Jupiter  will  trigger my own death, I find that
Jupiter triggers the deaths of those charts I  examine.    A
classic case of drawing like charts to oneself.]

     Or,  if you prefer using just the client's radix, there
are many astrologers who put in the Part of Death,  Part  of
Suicide,  Part  of  Poison,  Part  of  Peril,  and  Part  of
Misfortune in the chart.  Directing these to the angles, the
argument goes, times those periods when the client  must  be
on guard  for mayhem, adversity, and tragedy.  I enjoy using
the Uranian Placement Hades, as he  worsen  every  thing  he
touches [personal observation- for medical astrologers, please
look over the Uranians: They were postulated in the trenches
of World War I, and are excellent for personal mishaps].

     Given  the  belief  that the astrologer can determine a
client's death, should the astrologer tell the client?  That
depends on how much responsibility the astrologer wishes  to
take upon  herself / himself.  Putting aside such thought of
incurring "bad Karma" at causing the client to  bring  about
her  /  his own death, think about the possibility that you,
the astrologer, could be wrong!

     A scenario: The client is 35 years old, and, though you
don't know it, will live to be a ripe old 70.  He  comes  to
you  and asks the question "When, kind sir, will I die?" and
being the hard working, much experienced astrologer that you
are, you say back to him  "Well,  now.    You'll  drop  dead
January 17, 1992.    That gives you another 7 years.  You'll
die at age 56.  Was their anything  else?"    For  the  next
seven  years, below conscious thought, the client is getting
ready to die.  When January rolls around  he  will  1)  Drop
dead,  or 2) Get Horribly sick and almost die, 3) Send you a
post card saying "Ha, ha, ha, fooled you!",  or  perhaps  4)
Kill YOU out of general principles.

     Suppose it  was  number  1?  You told him to die and he
did.  Is that the reason you've worked so hard to  determine
one's death?   This extreme case could be considered murder.
Why not be a liar and just say "You'll live to be 110,"  and
let the client die at 70?  That way the client is not around
to demand his money back, and your ass is covered.

     Well,  OK. You don't wish to lie to your clients, and I
hope you don't.  Here's what * I * would do, as  I  find  it
works.   Make  a  list  of  no less that 20 periods when the
client should be extra careful.    Include  the  period  you
believe the  client  will  die.    Then throw in five or six
"easy" periods as well.  Tell the client  that  these  dates
are those  she or he should watch out for her / himself.  Be
damn sure you include time periods beyond a reasonable  time
that  one  may  expect to live (that is, list a time span or
two where the client is 110 or 120 years old).  It  is  very
important  to ask the client to call you back (or visit you)
after these periods and get her / his input  on  how  things
are going.

     "But,"  you  say, and rightly so, "that could cause the
client to have hardship she or he may not have been  'meant'
to have!"  Being forewarned, I reply, is better than getting
one's teeth kicked in.  Make a list of safety practices, and
list  the  periods  extra  care must be taken on top of this
list.

     ". . .  You wait a moment to collect your thoughts, and
give her your answer."

     "The best I can do," you truthfully say,  "is  to  give
you periods  where  you  must be extra careful.  I feel, and
past experience has born me out, that  one  may  step  aside
when harm approaches.  This is a list of precautions I would
like you to take."  You hand over a list, keeping a copy for
yourself. "At the top," you continue, "is things I think you
must do  a  few  weeks before these periods.  Make sure your
car's breaks are in order, have  a  doctor  look  you  over,
etc."   You  pause. "The second part of this list are things
to do during these time spans.  Always  wear  a  seat  belt,
take extra  care in the bathroom, etc."  You quickly go over
the list, and make sure the client understand.

     Be sure the client knows that she or he may  bring  the
subject  of  death  up  again at any time in the future, and
continue the session.

     You close the door after showing your client out.   The
familiar  warmth  inside comes to you, as it does after many
successful sessions.  Such potential in that chart, in  your
client!   What  a  horrible  disservice, you think, it would
have been to answer her question "When will I die?"  with  a
number and a date.

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